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PAUL
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 02:30 AM |
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I AM VERY SORRY EVERYONE. I WAS EDITING MY OWN POST AND SCREWED UP AND DELETED THE WHOLE POST. IT IS A SHAME TO, BECAUSE PEOPLE WERE MAKING EXCELLENT POINTS, EXCEPT "SR"...LMAO...JUST KIDDING YOU SHAWN.
RICK PLEASE START IT AGAIN.
LIKE I SAID I AM AN IDIOT. THE WORST THING IS THAT I HAVE HAD NOTHING TO DRINK AND I CAN ONLY BLAME THE MISTAKE ON STUPIDITY.
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xingman
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 02:55 AM |
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It takes a brave man to open himself up to that kind of criticism.  Last edited on Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 02:55 AM by xingman
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PAUL
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 03:05 AM |
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Brave or stupid, I am not sure which one...LMAO!!!
Besides I have always gained lots of knowledge from my stupidity.
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oregon race fan
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 03:23 AM |
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Hey Paul,
As Forrest Gump would say, "Sh*t happens!"
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skinny42
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 05:54 AM |
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hey man, it happens, no worries. I seem to be the one that gets in a twist by it but I know how it goes. I was all excited to read it when I got home :-p
keep the heads
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Michelle N.
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 02:28 PM |
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As you all know, I got my hiney in the ringer with SR over the heads-the last thread I posted on got deleted and no one will tell me who stepped out of line! If it was me, I apologise.
BUT-
I will not support an open head rule for a NW 360 series, period. I think Fred's vision of the cost effectiveness, the competition, and a national (or regional) ASCS date was really starting to bear fruit. It has proved that racing can be on the drivers ability, not the size of the wallet. I don't want Bill to struggle all over again because we can't afford a hard hitting open motor. I don't want the Cali boys coming up for a Speedweek and taking home the top spots due to an open motor.
MY OPINION ?- I would rather have Bill quit than run an open motor again.
These are my opinions, NOT BILL'S, but ask him at Lebanon, Cottage Grove, or Yakima on his opinions. He'll be more than happy to give his perspective.
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rickt
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 03:20 PM |
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No Michelle, it was not really deleted. It is still in Gregs post in the "ramblings" thread about moving it to the ASCS vs OPEN thread. Thats all it was. I would have moved that post itself to the new thread but I don't know if it is possible to just move one post from thread to thread. As far as I know, it is not..Would not have made any diff now anyway since Pauls thumb got in his way...DOH
Is that what you were talkin about M.?
Last edited on Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 03:21 PM by rickt
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PAUL
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 03:59 PM |
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Hey Rick,
If you copy the web address for the thread you want to move and the click on "edit" at the bottom of the thread you want the copied on to merge with, you will see a box at the bottom saying "merge topics" or something like that. Just paste the web address and click on save the two forums will be merged.
BTw, it was not my thumb that got in the way, IT WAS MY STUPIDITY.
I thought the thread was going nicely and everyone was playing nice. I especially enjoyed a post by WinItorWearIt. It was their post that I was complimenting when I had a brain fart and poof, it was gone.
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rickt
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 04:06 PM |
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I hate that when it happens..Actually I was guilty of the same thing earlier this year. Like ORF says, "it happens"
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ChancesMom
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 04:18 PM |
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Paul........you're my kind of fellow! No candy coating, just the truth I did the same very thing last winter........accidently deleted 5 years of geneology! I did, however, manage to salvage the info but had to take the hard drive to somone smarter than I about 'puters
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CARCRASH
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 04:22 PM |
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Can I ask what is going on, When I seen that the subject was "I AM AN IDIOT"
I thought maybe someone hacked into somes account, and posted that.
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PAUL
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 05:29 PM |
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No, I am the idiot who deleted the thread about ASCS vs open motors. I was trying to edit my own post for a spelling error and deleted the whole thread by accident, DOH!!!!!! No hackers, just a stupid administrator.
ChancesMom,
Nice to see you are back posting stuff on here. I for one would love to hear about your sons racing plans for next year when the season is over, or earlier if youi guys already know. Some info on this season would be nice to. For those who do not know Chance Haman drives a super sport at Madras Speedway and he is very good.
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PAUL
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 05:54 PM |
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Okay it is apparent that many people have opinions on this subject so I may as well start up the thread I accidently deleted.
I will start off with my opinion.
I think the idea and vision that FB had with the ASCS heads is spot on to what needs to happen in order to take 360 racing in the NW to the next level. I don't own a car or drive a car, but from what I have been told by many drivers and crews is that the ASCS motor is the way to go.
However, whether they go back to open motor or not it will not affect the amount of races I go to. I will sit in the stands and drink my beer and enjoy the heck out of myself whatever the rule is. But, as WinItorWearIt stated in the other thread, the ASCS motor will allow the NW drivers to race at more tracks and let everyone know what we in the NW already know, our drivers have serious talent.
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GregB
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Posted: Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 06:20 PM |
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I will keep this thread alive as I feel it is important....... apparently my friend Paul got excited about it as well (Paul deleted our first attempt on accident... he is forgiven as he does much good here)
Last edited on Wednesday Sep 13th, 2006 06:32 PM by GregB
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skinny42
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 01:58 AM |
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well I will chime in again. I wish that there was a way to get the guys with open heads that cannot afford the ascs heads on the track. I suggested a weight penalty for those that run open heads. Would that make much difference? I just hate to see sprint cars not being raced because of an inability to get the right equipment.
also can we expect an announcement on the future of the Northern Sprint Tour soon?
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mdtroy
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 02:15 AM |
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Some may say that the ASCS heads don't do anything, but just look at the winners list for Grays Harbor Raceway:
Steve Vague (twice) Nick Engberg (twice) Jay Cole (twice) Bill Nutter Shawn Smith Mitch Olson (thrice)
Most of these teams would be considered "low dollar" teams (although we all know there is no such a thing in racing)
In addition, take time and look at the finishing positions of such teams as Dan Dunlap, Dave Gilmore, Brad Holmes, Eddie Evans or Ken Brogan, all driving more "low dollar" cars. In MY opionion it has done nothing but help the racing and competition at GHR in 2006 and we look forward to more great racing in the sprint class in 2007.
As far as 360 open motors go, just look to the future. Open 360 motors are not the future. The ASCS has nearly taken over the country and it would be foolish to think that they aren't going to continue to grow and dominate 360 racing in the country. Washington, Oregon and California are really the only places in the country that ASCS has not taken over...............yet. In time, the discussion of ASCS vs. open will be a mute point, because ASCS will be here and will be here to stay.
Very few poeople knew the whole story behind the ASCS conversion of the Northwest that was the vision of our leader, but I for one know that whatever he did, he did with the thought of the future of racing and wouldn't do anything that was going to alienate the Northwest from the rest of the country. Cottage Grove and Medford are already on the track of going ASCS. Other racetracks in the Northwest and California need to start the plan in motion to make the move. Fred took nearly four years to get the ASCS head rule fully in place for GHR and the NoST. It isn't going to happen overnight, but I wish it would.
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GregB
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 02:36 AM |
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skinny42 wrote: I wish that there was a way to get the guys with open heads that cannot afford the ascs heads on the track.
Skinny can I ask again who & how many?
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skinny42
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 02:40 AM |
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just a couple of guys I know, nobody that would be considered a "star", just a couple of guys that love to race for fun.
I'm just playing devil's advocate here--I love how competitive the ASCS heads make every doggone race, and I am a 100% supporter of the rule. Like I said before...just hate to see cars sitting ya know? Eventually everyone will have to get em, because there wont be a place you can run the heads/motors that the guys used to have to invest in. I'm hoping anyways, you never know what each promoter can/will do.
GregB wrote: skinny42 wrote: I wish that there was a way to get the guys with open heads that cannot afford the ascs heads on the track.
Skinny can I ask again who & how many?
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GregB
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 05:02 PM |
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skinny42 wrote: just a couple of guys I know, nobody that would be considered a "star", just a couple of guys that love to race for fun.
Have them call me and refer to your name I think I can help them.
360-427-8322 there is NO need for anyone to be sitting out.
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TODCO44
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 06:50 PM |
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| Just curious, does anybody have any "real" HP/torq numbers of an average ASCS motor compared to a spare no expense ASCS motor?
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flyinbrian
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 07:55 PM |
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What are some numbers?
I have talked with a couple of people regarding ASCS motors. The idea is great, but the amount of money spent on them almost reaches an open 360. One reason is lighter parts in the bottom end to create hp.
As for the "can't afford ASCS Heads" comment to change over from open heads, I believe there are intake gaskets that one can purchase. Here is an engine rule for the Winged Outlaw Warriors regarding non-spec heads and what they need to do:
"Non-spec heads will be allowed, but they must have an unaltered ASCS or Felpro #8E89208 intake-restricting gasket installed. Unaltered means absolutely no modifications to bolt holes or port sizing. These gaskets are to be installed right side up with logo on top."
Here is their link:
http://www.wowsprints.homestead.com/rules.html
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skinny42
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 08:22 PM |
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so what is to prevent this rule to be instituted at Grays Harbor and with the Northern Sprint Tour? Is there more to it than this?
flyinbrian wrote:
As for the "can't afford ASCS Heads" comment to change over from open heads, I believe there are intake gaskets that one can purchase. Here is an engine rule for the Winged Outlaw Warriors regarding non-spec heads and what they need to do:
"Non-spec heads will be allowed, but they must have an unaltered ASCS or Felpro #8E89208 intake-restricting gasket installed. Unaltered means absolutely no modifications to bolt holes or port sizing. These gaskets are to be installed right side up with logo on top."
Here is their link:
http://www.wowsprints.homestead.com/rules.html
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GregB
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 08:28 PM |
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skinny42 wrote: so what is to prevent this rule to be instituted at Grays Harbor and with the Northern Sprint Tour? Is there more to it than this?
flyinbrian wrote:
As for the "can't afford ASCS Heads" comment to change over from open heads, I believe there are intake gaskets that one can purchase. Here is an engine rule for the Winged Outlaw Warriors regarding non-spec heads and what they need to do:
"Non-spec heads will be allowed, but they must have an unaltered ASCS or Felpro #8E89208 intake-restricting gasket installed. Unaltered means absolutely no modifications to bolt holes or port sizing. These gaskets are to be installed right side up with logo on top."
Here is their link:
http://www.wowsprints.homestead.com/rules.html
Nothing other than you would be aligning with the WoW series not the ASCS series. GHR is ASCS for 2007.
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GregB
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 08:30 PM |
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Hello all, I have been asked by Shawna Wilskey to post the following link. This is not an endorsement by me, just a post. Below the link I will post some thoughts that I previously posted and were unintentionally deleted.
http://www.racenscs.com/
Personally I think that the changing of the engine rules would be a disgrace to all that Fred and his crew have worked towards for the last 11+ years. Let alone what it is saying to each and every driver that ran a Northern Sprint Tour Race or GHR race this year. It is said that some 80+% of the 360 series in the US. are now ASCS why do we want to be any different? We were being aligned with what the majority are doing.... can we not continue in that forward direction? I/we have witnessed ASCS working in 2006 with both the Northern Sprint Tour & the GHR weekly series.
Unified racing will increase car count, one in the same. If the promoters are requesting unification then put it in their laps. They are the ones that benefit by evened competition, national recognition, car count and fan count. Why should a series that runs 16 to 18 races be the one to change for all? Lead by example, hold true to the rules, and the benefit will be had by all.
I wish Shawna & Crew the best but if this change does happen I will still feel this is a step in reverse and we all know Sprint Cars don't have reverse.
Greg Burgess - speaking for Greg Burgess.... oh ya (I approve this post
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rickt
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 08:41 PM |
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| Was wondering how long it was gonna be before that link was up..
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PAUL
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 08:58 PM |
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I guess that link say it all. We will have to wait until the end of October for the final decision to be made.
I like the new title of the series.
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flyinbrian
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 09:18 PM |
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GregB wrote: skinny42 wrote: so what is to prevent this rule to be instituted at Grays Harbor and with the Northern Sprint Tour? Is there more to it than this?
flyinbrian wrote:
As for the "can't afford ASCS Heads" comment to change over from open heads, I believe there are intake gaskets that one can purchase. Here is an engine rule for the Winged Outlaw Warriors regarding non-spec heads and what they need to do:
"Non-spec heads will be allowed, but they must have an unaltered ASCS or Felpro #8E89208 intake-restricting gasket installed. Unaltered means absolutely no modifications to bolt holes or port sizing. These gaskets are to be installed right side up with logo on top."
Here is their link:
http://www.wowsprints.homestead.com/rules.html
Nothing other than you would be aligning with the WoW series not the ASCS series. GHR is ASCS for 2007.
I believe the gaskets are stamped ASCS on them. They have been around for a while so people can compete cross platform.
If one wants to make it economical, don't allow any titanium in the motor (i.e. valves). Food for thought.
Last edited on Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 09:21 PM by flyinbrian
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mesprint69
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 11:24 PM |
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| If some tracks and sanctions on the West coast don`t want to switch to ASCS, this will at least let some teams compete with NSCS for now. It doesn`t solve the problem, but it`s a bandaid for now! It may get car counts back up.
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GregB
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 11:26 PM |
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mesprint69 wrote: It may get car counts back up.
were they down?
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mesprint69
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 11:31 PM |
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| YES they were! Not counting speedweek( always good for that ) Only 26 cars is not a good car count. They used to get 40 cars on an average. Skagit cars weren`t legal and we lost guys like Jimmy Trulley, Herman Klein and some other Cali guys that ran here frequently.
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GregB
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 11:36 PM |
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mesprint69 wrote: YES they were! Not counting speedweek( always good for that ) Only 26 cars is not a good car count. They used to get 40 cars on an average. Skagit cars weren`t legal and we lost guys like Jimmy Trulley, Herman Klein and some other Cali guys that ran here frequently.
I think the first race of the year was 26 cars .... every other one I think was 35+ .......... so I am not sure they were off very much. The more competitive racing was MORE than worth it.
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mesprint69
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 11:43 PM |
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| There wasn`t any more races to base it on ! Just that first race at Willamette and Speedweek. All others were rained out or cancelled. This weekend will be the true test as we will see what car counts are. Speedweek always does well because they can stay for the whole week, lets see what car counts are like this weekend. I sure hope I see more than 26 cars show up.
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GregB
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 11:46 PM |
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mesprint69 wrote: There wasn`t any more races to base it on ! Just that first race at Willamette and Speedweek. I sure hope I see more than 26 cars show up.
me too .............. but if not a full field of these guys put on a GREAT show!
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GregB
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 11:48 PM |
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Interesting addition to the subject - Just spoke with Fred Rannard Northern/National ST announcer who said to say hi to everyone and he hoped to see alot of us in Yakima as it will be the end of an era and the final Northern Sprint Tour Race for the history of the series.
While talking I asked him about his travels this year and what he seen as far as 360 rules across the nation.... his response...
IT IS NOT EVEN CLOSE.... other than WA,OR,CA it is all ASCS .... he said he is sure there are some open tracks but not many was his opinion and experience this year .... that once again the West Coast was behind the rest of the racing world.
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mesprint69
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 11:49 PM |
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| True, but I enjoy seeing drivers have to work for it through the C and B mains! Theres no drama if you know that if you show up your gonna run in the A
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GregB
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 11:51 PM |
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mesprint69 wrote: True, but I enjoy seeing drivers have to work for it through the C and B mains! Theres no drama if you know that if you show up your gonna run in the A
I agree more cars are cool to see but I am willing to support light car counts for a couple years if it brings more of what I witnessed this year at GHR and NST shows. Plus aligns promoters and drivers with tracks elswhere.
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mesprint69
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Posted: Thursday Sep 14th, 2006 11:54 PM |
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| I agree that ASCS is the future, but last I heard, Beitler and Cali`s Cival War want nothing to do with it. So until that changes what are the drivers gonna do? At least this NSCS restrictor plate will keep things going until changes are made elsewhere.
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GregB
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Posted: Friday Sep 15th, 2006 12:02 AM |
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mesprint69 wrote: Beitler and Cali`s Cival War want nothing to do with it.
EXACTLY - that is where the problem lies not with the 40 + car owners in the NW and the majority of the nation that have made the switch and are happy with it. It is time they made a change or not ... it should be up to them but not these guys they are already operating in the future.
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Bluteam
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Posted: Friday Sep 15th, 2006 12:08 AM |
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http://www.nwracechat.com/view_topic.php?id=1877&forum_id=11
So what has changed?
June 16th - thats it.
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speedbuggy
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Posted: Friday Sep 15th, 2006 12:22 AM |
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mesprint69 wrote: YES they were! Not counting speedweek( always good for that ) Only 26 cars is not a good car count. They used to get 40 cars on an average. Skagit cars weren`t legal and we lost guys like Jimmy Trulley, Herman Klein and some other Cali guys that ran here frequently. Both Trulli and Klein ran NST this past year.
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